pappu
06-10 12:28 PM
WAKE UP CALL FOR THOSE STILL SITTING ON THE SIDELINES
On Tuesday, when we were on the Hill doing meetings during Advocacy days, we were informed by the senior Senate office that an amendment to prevent H1 and work authorizations is in the works in the Tax bill. We immediately requested this office to oppose this amendment. Senator office expressed full support for us and shared with us that the Senator's office has already expressed opposition to such an amendment.
We would like everyone to know that just because someone has EAD, it does not mean we are in safe haven. There is no safe haven till we have approved green cards. And for those who think that they don't need to participate actively, this is a wake up call.
We have also learned that this is degree 1 amendment. This means it will be voted on on the Senate floor even when it is non-germane to the bill. We have also learned that if such an amendment comes up for vote during this difficult political climate, it appears that such an amendment will have 70 votes in the senate which makes each one of us extremely vulnerable to be forced out. Everyone on H1, L1, J1 or EAD will risk the renewal of their current application status.
IV is working on defeating this amendment. Please stay tuned for further updates.
On Tuesday, Mr. Sanders sponsored an amendment S.AMDT.4319 in bill H.R.4213
AMENDMENT PURPOSE: Purpose will be available when the amendment is proposed for consideration. See Congressional Record for text.
TEXT OF AMENDMENT AS SUBMITTED: CR S4754
COSPONSORS(2):
Sen Grassley, Chuck [IA] - 6/9/2010
Sen Harkin, Tom [IA] - 6/9/2010
Source: Congressional Record - 111th Congress (2009-2010) - THOMAS (Library of Congress) (http://www.thomas.gov/cgi-bin/query/F?r111:1:./temp/~r1119eE0Na:e98:)
SA 4319. Mr. SANDERS (for himself, Mr. Grassley, and Mr. Harkin) submitted an amendment intended to be proposed by him to the bill H.R. 4213, to amend the Internal Revenue Code of 1986 to extend certain expiring provisions, and for other purposes; which was ordered to lie on the table; as follows:
At the appropriate place, insert the following:
SEC. __. CERTIFICATION REQUIREMENT.
(a) Short Title.--This section may be cited as the ``Employ America Act''.
(b) In General.--The Secretary of Homeland Security may not approve a petition by an employer for any visa authorizing employment in the United States unless the employer has provided written certification, under penalty of perjury, to the Secretary of Labor that--
(1) the employer has not provided a notice of a mass layoff pursuant to the Worker Adjustment and Retraining Notification Act (29 U.S.C. 2101 et seq.) during the 12-month period immediately preceding the date on which the alien is scheduled to be hired; and
(2) the employer does not intend to provide a notice of a mass layoff pursuant to such Act.
(c) Effect of Mass Layoff.--If an employer provides a notice of a mass layoff pursuant to the Worker Adjustment and Retraining Notification Act after the approval of a visa described in subsection (b), any visas approved during the most recent 12-month period for such employer shall expire on the date that is 60 days after the date on which such notice is provided. The expiration of a visa under this subsection shall not be subject to judicial review.
(d) Notice Requirement.--Upon receiving notification of a mass layoff from an employer, the Secretary of Homeland Security shall inform each employee whose visa is scheduled to expire under subsection (c)--
(1) the date on which such individual will no longer be authorized to work in the United States; and
(2) the date on which such individual will be required to leave the United States unless the individual is otherwise authorized to remain in the United States.
(e) Exemption.--An employer shall be exempt from the requirements under this section if the employer provides written certification, under penalty of perjury, to the Secretary of Labor that the total number of the employer's workers who are United States citizens and are working in the United States have not been, and will not be, reduced as a result of a mass layoff described in subsection (c).
(f) Rulemaking.--Not later than 90 days after the date of the enactment of this Act, the Secretary of Homeland Security and the Secretary of Labor shall promulgate regulations to carry out this section, including a requirement that employers provide notice to the Secretary of Homeland Security of a mass layoff (as defined in section 2 of the Worker Adjustment and Retraining Notification Act (29 U.S.C. 2101)).
On Tuesday, when we were on the Hill doing meetings during Advocacy days, we were informed by the senior Senate office that an amendment to prevent H1 and work authorizations is in the works in the Tax bill. We immediately requested this office to oppose this amendment. Senator office expressed full support for us and shared with us that the Senator's office has already expressed opposition to such an amendment.
We would like everyone to know that just because someone has EAD, it does not mean we are in safe haven. There is no safe haven till we have approved green cards. And for those who think that they don't need to participate actively, this is a wake up call.
We have also learned that this is degree 1 amendment. This means it will be voted on on the Senate floor even when it is non-germane to the bill. We have also learned that if such an amendment comes up for vote during this difficult political climate, it appears that such an amendment will have 70 votes in the senate which makes each one of us extremely vulnerable to be forced out. Everyone on H1, L1, J1 or EAD will risk the renewal of their current application status.
IV is working on defeating this amendment. Please stay tuned for further updates.
On Tuesday, Mr. Sanders sponsored an amendment S.AMDT.4319 in bill H.R.4213
AMENDMENT PURPOSE: Purpose will be available when the amendment is proposed for consideration. See Congressional Record for text.
TEXT OF AMENDMENT AS SUBMITTED: CR S4754
COSPONSORS(2):
Sen Grassley, Chuck [IA] - 6/9/2010
Sen Harkin, Tom [IA] - 6/9/2010
Source: Congressional Record - 111th Congress (2009-2010) - THOMAS (Library of Congress) (http://www.thomas.gov/cgi-bin/query/F?r111:1:./temp/~r1119eE0Na:e98:)
SA 4319. Mr. SANDERS (for himself, Mr. Grassley, and Mr. Harkin) submitted an amendment intended to be proposed by him to the bill H.R. 4213, to amend the Internal Revenue Code of 1986 to extend certain expiring provisions, and for other purposes; which was ordered to lie on the table; as follows:
At the appropriate place, insert the following:
SEC. __. CERTIFICATION REQUIREMENT.
(a) Short Title.--This section may be cited as the ``Employ America Act''.
(b) In General.--The Secretary of Homeland Security may not approve a petition by an employer for any visa authorizing employment in the United States unless the employer has provided written certification, under penalty of perjury, to the Secretary of Labor that--
(1) the employer has not provided a notice of a mass layoff pursuant to the Worker Adjustment and Retraining Notification Act (29 U.S.C. 2101 et seq.) during the 12-month period immediately preceding the date on which the alien is scheduled to be hired; and
(2) the employer does not intend to provide a notice of a mass layoff pursuant to such Act.
(c) Effect of Mass Layoff.--If an employer provides a notice of a mass layoff pursuant to the Worker Adjustment and Retraining Notification Act after the approval of a visa described in subsection (b), any visas approved during the most recent 12-month period for such employer shall expire on the date that is 60 days after the date on which such notice is provided. The expiration of a visa under this subsection shall not be subject to judicial review.
(d) Notice Requirement.--Upon receiving notification of a mass layoff from an employer, the Secretary of Homeland Security shall inform each employee whose visa is scheduled to expire under subsection (c)--
(1) the date on which such individual will no longer be authorized to work in the United States; and
(2) the date on which such individual will be required to leave the United States unless the individual is otherwise authorized to remain in the United States.
(e) Exemption.--An employer shall be exempt from the requirements under this section if the employer provides written certification, under penalty of perjury, to the Secretary of Labor that the total number of the employer's workers who are United States citizens and are working in the United States have not been, and will not be, reduced as a result of a mass layoff described in subsection (c).
(f) Rulemaking.--Not later than 90 days after the date of the enactment of this Act, the Secretary of Homeland Security and the Secretary of Labor shall promulgate regulations to carry out this section, including a requirement that employers provide notice to the Secretary of Homeland Security of a mass layoff (as defined in section 2 of the Worker Adjustment and Retraining Notification Act (29 U.S.C. 2101)).
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CSPAvictim
07-09 07:24 PM
Clause B is not the only thing. In any quarter they are not supposed to issue any more than 27% of 140,000(100%) = 37800. according to Clause A. After June 15th they issued 140,000 - 66000 = 74000. What about the last quarter quota of 37800? Where did it go? It was not supposed to be used before July.
On second thoughts, it seems like you're talking about the 37800 for the last quarter. Well, I havent yet come across any law/regulation that prevents USCIS from using up all the visa numbers before the last quarter. And like I said before, the last quarter is not subject to the 27% limitation. Over the years, USCIS has not been using up all the numbers for the fiscal year. This time, they did the opposite and used them up in the first three quarters itself!:eek:
On second thoughts, it seems like you're talking about the 37800 for the last quarter. Well, I havent yet come across any law/regulation that prevents USCIS from using up all the visa numbers before the last quarter. And like I said before, the last quarter is not subject to the 27% limitation. Over the years, USCIS has not been using up all the numbers for the fiscal year. This time, they did the opposite and used them up in the first three quarters itself!:eek:
ak27
11-20 10:51 AM
Hello,
I am from Plainsboro NJ..
TL PD 09/20/2004
PERM Conv stuff for last 8 months..
What is the best way to invite folks to join IV..
NJ has south asian programming on comcast on Sat and Sun. Can we some how put something through them.
Also, should we try to meet Newly Elect Sen Bob Menedez and try explain our situations.
Let us try to do our bit folks....
I am from Plainsboro NJ..
TL PD 09/20/2004
PERM Conv stuff for last 8 months..
What is the best way to invite folks to join IV..
NJ has south asian programming on comcast on Sat and Sun. Can we some how put something through them.
Also, should we try to meet Newly Elect Sen Bob Menedez and try explain our situations.
Let us try to do our bit folks....
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gauravsh
03-09 06:45 PM
Quick question guys :- My PD is feb 2008 and I140 was approved in july 08.
I also want to call my congessman, can you please tell what are the things you talk to them?
A brief guidance will help many others like me to make a call.
~
I also want to call my congessman, can you please tell what are the things you talk to them?
A brief guidance will help many others like me to make a call.
~
more...
nlssubbu
12-27 02:33 PM
Dubai - no issues without valid stamp
Frankfurt, Munich, Hamburg - I heard no issues now, if u have valid i 797 - waiting forr some comments
Amsterdam/Schiphol - No issue without valid stamp
London - ?????
Seoul - ?????
Singapore - ??????
Bangkok - ?????
Kuwait - ?????
Zurich -- ????
Geneva -- ???
I know that Seoul, Bangkok and Singapore does not need transit visa, if you do not step out of the Airport and have a connecting flight resevered for your outbound destination.
Frankfurt, Munich, Hamburg - I heard no issues now, if u have valid i 797 - waiting forr some comments
Amsterdam/Schiphol - No issue without valid stamp
London - ?????
Seoul - ?????
Singapore - ??????
Bangkok - ?????
Kuwait - ?????
Zurich -- ????
Geneva -- ???
I know that Seoul, Bangkok and Singapore does not need transit visa, if you do not step out of the Airport and have a connecting flight resevered for your outbound destination.
indrachat_75
05-15 05:11 PM
Hi,
One of my friend needs some advice :
I am in Company A on L1A. Client (Company B) wants to hire me on H1-B. Can I do it now ?
Please advice.
Indra
One of my friend needs some advice :
I am in Company A on L1A. Client (Company B) wants to hire me on H1-B. Can I do it now ?
Please advice.
Indra
more...
saimrathi
07-05 01:52 PM
In the time it took you to write all this up, mayb you coudl have enlightened a senator or two...
I think atleast the forums section should be made restricted to contributing members. I see many newcomers (both paying and freebies) come to this site and hoping to get a quick guidence on their immigration issue. They come here becasue they know a) they will get some answer quickly b) that answer will make sense and experinced users here who have gone through similar situation will share their insights.
Those are major outcomes or results for not paying any dime.
I can understand someone's concern about asking everyone to pay certain amount. But most of us here are earning decent wages and can contribute atleast 3$ a month (or 25$ a year) for such a service.
If those members want to contribute more as many of us do then they are most welcome to do so.
In $$$ terms of the 12K + members we can retain 40% (about 5K) and each of them contributes atleast 25$ a year (one time payment) = $75,000.00
Remember this $75K is only based on basic membership fees. Any dropouts or reduced rate of conversion will be compensated by those '20$ a month' paying members (roughly by 1 as to 10).
In short, I support this idea of having majority of forums under restricted umbrella.
- PMAMP
I think atleast the forums section should be made restricted to contributing members. I see many newcomers (both paying and freebies) come to this site and hoping to get a quick guidence on their immigration issue. They come here becasue they know a) they will get some answer quickly b) that answer will make sense and experinced users here who have gone through similar situation will share their insights.
Those are major outcomes or results for not paying any dime.
I can understand someone's concern about asking everyone to pay certain amount. But most of us here are earning decent wages and can contribute atleast 3$ a month (or 25$ a year) for such a service.
If those members want to contribute more as many of us do then they are most welcome to do so.
In $$$ terms of the 12K + members we can retain 40% (about 5K) and each of them contributes atleast 25$ a year (one time payment) = $75,000.00
Remember this $75K is only based on basic membership fees. Any dropouts or reduced rate of conversion will be compensated by those '20$ a month' paying members (roughly by 1 as to 10).
In short, I support this idea of having majority of forums under restricted umbrella.
- PMAMP
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Pagal
07-02 01:45 AM
It will only take less then 1 minute of your time to click this link ImmigrationVoice.org - Advocacy -- OPPOSE the Sanders-Grassley-Harkin amendment S.AMDT.4319 in bill H.R.4213 which severely hurts Competitiveness, Innovation and creating jobs in America (http://immigrationvoice.capwiz.com/immigrationvoice/issues/alert/?alertid=15130466)
Hello,
Done...this is a neat tool! Makes advocacy fast and efficient!
Hello,
Done...this is a neat tool! Makes advocacy fast and efficient!
more...
Roger Binny
10-11 08:13 PM
There are so many illegal immigrats working as lawn tenders, cleaners at stores....why doens't USCIS go after them? They are easy to spot and can be found anywhere...why harrass students?
USCIS perceives students are smart and sets standards by following rules than uneducated brothers.
It's not harassing it has altogether different meaning, i too doesn't know when they first asked me, but one needs to keep cool and explain the reality it would work.
I agree with other OP saying checking bio-metric is best than carrying these important documents around, all we know it need big budget.
USCIS perceives students are smart and sets standards by following rules than uneducated brothers.
It's not harassing it has altogether different meaning, i too doesn't know when they first asked me, but one needs to keep cool and explain the reality it would work.
I agree with other OP saying checking bio-metric is best than carrying these important documents around, all we know it need big budget.
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angelfire76
02-13 05:03 PM
This is a real life example that happened a week ago. I was at the gym talking to a guy and he was asking where I was working. I told him and I got a look that suggested it was a crime for me to have a job.....No words exchanged but just the look of it...I could feel it..
Same sense of entitlement to everything landed the US in the soup they are in right now?
There are some very hard-working and bright people and I'm not generalizing here, but they need to understand the the foreign worker (who's probably being paid less than you to do the same job) is not the enemy. The unsustainable lifestyle is.
Same sense of entitlement to everything landed the US in the soup they are in right now?
There are some very hard-working and bright people and I'm not generalizing here, but they need to understand the the foreign worker (who's probably being paid less than you to do the same job) is not the enemy. The unsustainable lifestyle is.
more...
yawl
07-16 05:13 PM
they are shameless liars and racists
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bazuka6
11-21 11:02 PM
That's probably the path most people with (EB3 2003 onwards/EB2 2004 onwards) will take from now on. The only hurdle is there is no clarity about the law regarding H1B extensions granted on an approved I-140. Most people have run out of H1B and will have to change jobs on the extensions. I hope USCIS issues a clear guidance on this issue. Also you might not have to let go of the priority date if your company is kind enough.
There is clear guidance in that H1-B petitioner seeking extension does not have to be the same employer that had filed (and approved) the I-140. Once you have an approved 140, anyone can extend your H1 for 3 years
There is clear guidance in that H1-B petitioner seeking extension does not have to be the same employer that had filed (and approved) the I-140. Once you have an approved 140, anyone can extend your H1 for 3 years
more...
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northstar
05-23 05:38 PM
Here is the issue: If you are thinking of doing MBA to get a management job in a US company and are an Indian, please forget it. You might get a low level management position paying at most 80K. MBA is not for everyone - you have to have it in you to get something out of an MBA. It's not about landing that good job. You hear about the 1 crore offers that IIM students get from top American companies? Well, they are kicked out of the job in 1 year and then join Infosys or Wipro. Not because they are not brilliant but because their conversational skills are terrible and so is their language. Unless you are planning to settle in India OR REALLY THINKING OF PUTTING A LOT OF EFFORT in mastering the English language and your outlook, an MBA is not going to serve you in the US.
Like, someone said, an MBA is more than just a degree. You can get a better, much higher paying job (300K+) without an MBA but with excellent logic, hard work, conversational skills and outgoing personality. No GC required :)
GCVivek, I wanted to write that post, but you did already :)
Like, someone said, an MBA is more than just a degree. You can get a better, much higher paying job (300K+) without an MBA but with excellent logic, hard work, conversational skills and outgoing personality. No GC required :)
GCVivek, I wanted to write that post, but you did already :)
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god_bless_you
12-13 10:57 AM
I know , More than 50% of IV members who can not file I 485 due to retrogression will be happy to pay this nominal amount of $10 to fax letter to USCIS for rule change
but What is the stand of Core group on this?
No update from any one!!
but What is the stand of Core group on this?
No update from any one!!
more...
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pappu
03-10 03:03 PM
Do you fully realize your statement about the 2A category which is for spouses and children of green card holders? That means that if someone got a green card (whether through the family or EB category), they have to wait 5+ years to reunite with their spouse and children. At least those with H1B can bring their spouse into the country right away.
I have been lurking on this forum to understand the plight of EB immigrants and the posts the last few weeks have confirmed my belief that the problem exist because a lot of people came to the US from 1999-2006 and want to stay here permanently. The EB immigration system was fine before then; thus, the problem is supply/demand, not the immigration policies.
Please input correct and full details in your tracker profile or leave everything empty
I have been lurking on this forum to understand the plight of EB immigrants and the posts the last few weeks have confirmed my belief that the problem exist because a lot of people came to the US from 1999-2006 and want to stay here permanently. The EB immigration system was fine before then; thus, the problem is supply/demand, not the immigration policies.
Please input correct and full details in your tracker profile or leave everything empty
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srikondoji
07-04 08:58 PM
Rambha:
First hats off to you to source information and then put it on this forum.
However, how will this mistake be rectified?
What happens to us who have spend so much money on preparations?
Among these 700K or so applicants, iam not sure how many have to leave the country because of various reasons before there PDs become current again in near future.
In that case, who should reimburse the costs? If this was a case of poor customer service, then they should also follow this age old saying in business community "Customer is always right" and promptly refund the expenses incurred.
I am for requesting the congress for a special vehicle for july filers. There should be a way out for all the affected applicants no matter what their PD was.
In matter of 2 weeks, the billion dollar mistake have costed us dearly in lot many other ways.
First hats off to you to source information and then put it on this forum.
However, how will this mistake be rectified?
What happens to us who have spend so much money on preparations?
Among these 700K or so applicants, iam not sure how many have to leave the country because of various reasons before there PDs become current again in near future.
In that case, who should reimburse the costs? If this was a case of poor customer service, then they should also follow this age old saying in business community "Customer is always right" and promptly refund the expenses incurred.
I am for requesting the congress for a special vehicle for july filers. There should be a way out for all the affected applicants no matter what their PD was.
In matter of 2 weeks, the billion dollar mistake have costed us dearly in lot many other ways.
more...
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indio0617
02-15 01:06 PM
Berkeleybee,
Just so that you know, I am caught in the name check too. This is a bigger blackhole than even labor processing. Becos atleast labor processing your Immigration Attorneys can write to BECs (You may or may not get a reply, that is a different issue, but atleast it is allowed). In case of FBI name check, you just cant do much. It is a much dreaded process in the whole game and needs to get enough focus. Eventually, it is going to be everybodys problem.
Thanks.
You are probably aware of these and have already tried it.
1. Heard the attorney / employer can file for some extra paperwork to expedite name check. I am not sure what it is... Have you checked into it.
2. Request your Senator / Congress staff to look ibto your case. I heard that often hastens the process. Some of my friends have had success with that approach.
FYI: My employer (Healthcare) has had phenomenal success with I-485 approvals. Average processing time has been 6 months.
Just so that you know, I am caught in the name check too. This is a bigger blackhole than even labor processing. Becos atleast labor processing your Immigration Attorneys can write to BECs (You may or may not get a reply, that is a different issue, but atleast it is allowed). In case of FBI name check, you just cant do much. It is a much dreaded process in the whole game and needs to get enough focus. Eventually, it is going to be everybodys problem.
Thanks.
You are probably aware of these and have already tried it.
1. Heard the attorney / employer can file for some extra paperwork to expedite name check. I am not sure what it is... Have you checked into it.
2. Request your Senator / Congress staff to look ibto your case. I heard that often hastens the process. Some of my friends have had success with that approach.
FYI: My employer (Healthcare) has had phenomenal success with I-485 approvals. Average processing time has been 6 months.
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sumansk
04-04 11:52 AM
Hello Guys..
Here is the summary of the H-1 B reform bill introduced last week in Senate..
God Bless All of 'US' !!
http://durbin.senate.gov/record.cfm?id=271783
Here is the summary of the H-1 B reform bill introduced last week in Senate..
God Bless All of 'US' !!
http://durbin.senate.gov/record.cfm?id=271783
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go_gc_way
01-18 04:20 PM
we need some more members to keep this effort stay ignited. This effort has helped us get several hundred members in the past few weeks. Pls continue to help. It will only take 15 min of your time.
Thanks Pappu :D (Pappu, left a PM, pl reply. Wouldn't mind if you don't come back , you are busy. Thanks)
Several hundred members ... only about 50 posts !!
That's true, once it is posted on a web site, most likely many members of that site will come read the thread. How many will read, will go on increasing each day, east posting.
Extraordinary effort perm2gc and others, please keep it up !!
Members , give it a thought ... give a free gift, more the members ...best our efforts.
Thanks Pappu :D (Pappu, left a PM, pl reply. Wouldn't mind if you don't come back , you are busy. Thanks)
Several hundred members ... only about 50 posts !!
That's true, once it is posted on a web site, most likely many members of that site will come read the thread. How many will read, will go on increasing each day, east posting.
Extraordinary effort perm2gc and others, please keep it up !!
Members , give it a thought ... give a free gift, more the members ...best our efforts.
Legal
06-30 09:10 PM
The current events starting from a rumor has caused frustration in our members. The news coming out of AILA got us into action and we are working on trying to prevent this visa bulletin disaster to happen for our members. Due to weekend, There are less opportunities to pursue but we are not taking this as an excuse and please know that IV is working this weekend and have been working ever since we heard about this news and are using all measures and contacts at the appropriate levels of government to help our members. At this time we do not have a conclusive outcome for our members as the efforts are continuing. The efforts are in full swing and will continue until the bulletin comes out. We are prepared to make efforts on Monday when the offices open.
Be assured we are considering all options. We are also working with like minded organizations and on
our own to prevent this disaster to happen for our members. IV is committed to pursue measures in case of any
visa bulletin that will change the current dates.
Please be patient and continue to support us. We will continue to update on the website as we have any more
update to share. The DOS's actions, USCIS actions and the resulting litigation from USCIS or other plaintiffs will take time to materialize and core group will post updates and action items as soon as there is something actionable that we wish for all our members to participate.
Please continue with your 485 filing process and file your 485 as soon as possible. Do not be late and do not postpone or slow down your 485 filing work due to rumors or other fears. Keep doing what you are doing.
IV may post update about its course of action as early as Sunday evening.
IV team
Thanks for the update.
Be assured we are considering all options. We are also working with like minded organizations and on
our own to prevent this disaster to happen for our members. IV is committed to pursue measures in case of any
visa bulletin that will change the current dates.
Please be patient and continue to support us. We will continue to update on the website as we have any more
update to share. The DOS's actions, USCIS actions and the resulting litigation from USCIS or other plaintiffs will take time to materialize and core group will post updates and action items as soon as there is something actionable that we wish for all our members to participate.
Please continue with your 485 filing process and file your 485 as soon as possible. Do not be late and do not postpone or slow down your 485 filing work due to rumors or other fears. Keep doing what you are doing.
IV may post update about its course of action as early as Sunday evening.
IV team
Thanks for the update.
CADude
02-20 06:32 PM
If possible, please change it without any delay? EB3 is only able to cross past May 2001 for 3 times in last 3 years where EB2 are enjoying GC most of time. No point in playing wait game with EB3 India. Otherwise, you will wait for-ever. :)
Does anyone want to make a guess of when EB3 India 2002 will become current ? I am thinking of changing the case to EB2.. Should I change my case or should I wait for EB3 to be current ?
Does anyone want to make a guess of when EB3 India 2002 will become current ? I am thinking of changing the case to EB2.. Should I change my case or should I wait for EB3 to be current ?
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